The productivity-pay gap is a significant issue in the economy, affecting workers, business owners, landlords, and everyone else together. It is caused by three wedges: changes in labor’s share, compensation inequality, and productivity. Changes in labor’s share shift how much income in the economy is received as compensation by workers and how much is received by capital owners. Compensation inequality refers to growing gaps in wages, benefits, and compensations between the top 1 percent and high-, middle-, and low-wage workers.
The pay-productivity gap is widely recognized, with industries that contribute to productivity growth suppressing pay and therefore responsible for the rising gap. Real wages used to rise roughly in step with productivity growth, but since 1973-2016, median compensation grew only 11 in real terms. This article explains why this approach falls short and suggests using a structured approach to pay equity analysis can help companies address systematic biases and address the exact issue.
The “productivity-pay gap” refers to the divergence between the increase in productivity rates and the increase in the average worker’s salary. The growth of inequalities is the central driver of the widening gap between the hourly compensation of a typical (median) worker and the wage of a typical worker. In a competitive labor market, if wages are below productive output, employers will demand more labor, raising wages and creating a pay gap.
In conclusion, the productivity-pay gap is not directly related to productivity, but rather to the divergence between the rate at which worker productivity increases and the rate at which wages grow. By understanding the factors contributing to the gap, companies can better address and improve their pay equity strategies.
📹 Jordan Peterson – Women in High Paying Jobs
Original source: https://www.youtube.com/embed/yXZSeiAl4PI Psychology Professor Dr. Jordan B. Peterson talks about women …
Who is responsible for productivity in a company?
It is the responsibility of employers to identify and address issues pertaining to employee productivity. Effective communication with employees and managers is essential for maintaining awareness of these issues. The act of listening to concerns and addressing them in a timely manner without resorting to micromanagement can help prevent problems from going unattended and foster a more productive workforce.
Is there a link between pay and productivity?
The moral property of the relationship between productivity and wages, where wages are equal to marginal revenue product, suggests that workers are compensated at a rate commensurate with their value to the firm.
Is HR responsible for productivity?
HR plays a crucial role in identifying and addressing productivity gaps through targeted training initiatives. By analyzing performance metrics and engaging with employees, HR professionals can identify areas where skill development can lead to significant productivity improvements. The Brandon Hall Group’s research findings reveal a growing gap between employee training and performance within organizations.
The study “Enhancing Learning for Optimal Performance: Strategies for Maximizing Learning Impact” highlights the importance of aligning learning objectives, business objectives, and talent development objectives.
Effective performance management strategies involve setting clear performance goals and expectations, which motivate employees and drive them towards achieving those goals. Aligning individual objectives with broader organizational objectives is essential for maximizing learning impact.
What is the disconnect between productivity and wages?
The Great Decoupling refers to the gap between the growth rate of median wages and the growth rate of GDP per person or productivity. This issue has been highlighted by Erik Brynjolfsson and Andrew McAfee in the late 20th and early 21st centuries, leading to wage stagnation for the median despite continued economic growth. Factors such as advances in technology, globalization, self-employment, and wage inequality have been hypothesized as causes.
On average, across 24 OECD countries, there has been significant decoupling of real median wage growth from productivity growth over the past two decades. There are large cross-country differences in overall decoupling and the extent to which it has gone together with real median wage stagnation. In countries with above-average productivity growth, real median wages have grown well above the OECD average. However, where productivity growth has been around or below the OECD average, decoupling has been associated with near-stagnation of real median wages.
In about a third of the covered OECD countries, real median wages have grown at similar or even higher rates than labor productivity. In some countries, such as the Czech Republic or Sweden, this has been associated with above-average real median wage growth, while in others with below-average productivity growth, real median wages have grown at very low rates.
How to determine the productivity of an employee?
The productivity of an employee is typically gauged by the time required to complete a given task, with those who are more proficient in their work being deemed more productive. Organizational procedures for measuring productivity are often established, but fundamental techniques such as monitoring task completions within a specified timeframe can facilitate the development of effective procedures.
What is a good productivity percentage?
A good productivity percentage is between 70 and 75, meaning that workers spend 70-75 of their working hours working and 25-30 hours on breaks. This is the optimal productivity rate for employees, as it ensures they work at a less intense pace, with no pressure or constant stress over deadlines. Burnout can result from not being at their most productive levels at all times. The 70 percent productivity rule suggests that employees should work at a less intense pace most of the time.
Does paying employees more increase productivity?
Research indicates that fair compensation can enhance worker engagement and performance. However, the impact of higher minimum wages on worker attachment is not uniform across industries. For instance, the fast food sector faces issues like wage theft, denial of breaks, overtime pay, workplace injuries, harassment, and retaliation. Therefore, companies should prioritize worker well-being and consider increasing minimum wages to ensure a positive work environment.
What is the productivity gap and why is it important?
The term “productivity gap” is used to describe the
discrepancy in output per worker or GDP per capita between countries. This gap is based on the efficiency of factor inputs, such as labor and capital, and is a key indicator of a country’s economic performance. In recent years, the UK economy has exhibited a sustained increase in productivity. However, the growth rate has been comparatively lower than that observed in many emerging economies and the United States.
How do you calculate productivity gap?
The project calculates potential output for German federal states using a neoclassical production function, focusing on labour, capital, and total factor productivity. It uses a standard Growth Accounting framework to present the growth shares of each input factor for each state’s real GDP growth. The project then defines scenarios and investigates potential output growth. The productivity gap is calculated as the difference in projected GDP per inhabitant and GDP per employee. The innovation gap is the growth rate in total factor productivity with which a specific target growth rate of GDP per capita is achieved.
Who is primarily responsible for productivity in an organization?
The primary responsibility of operations management is to enhance productivity.
What does productivity have to do with the wage you are paid?
The productivity-pay gap is the significant disparity between worker productivity and wage growth, indicating that productivity has outpaced wages, leaving most workers behind. Corporate profits often grow faster than productivity, allowing companies to directly benefit from this gap. Productivity, measured per labor hour or hour worked, is the output of goods and services, and when comparing productivity over time, net productivity is considered, subtracting any depreciation per hour worked.
📹 Responsibility vs. Accountability vs. OWNERSHIP | Team Performance | HR and Business Leaders
Bad leaders lay out responsibilities and tell people what to do because they can. Good leaders set an example, keep others …
This last year, I started making $65,000 a year give or take, the highest I’ve ever made in my life. I have flexible hours, 30 days paid vacation a year, and a modest health plan. I honestly can’t imagine a better job for me, and the idea of working even one hour more than I already do, simply to add a few thousand to my salary just doesn’t seem worth it. We’re all dying, and thusly our time is our most valuable asset. My job pays my bills and maximizes my personal time.
I agree, I love my job but I would happily leave it to raise my children once I have them. I hate when people say that women shouldnt do that because it isnt the ‘feminist’ thing to do. I do what I damn well please !!! Being a feminist should be about giving women the choice not forcing them into compliance.
I take everything he says with a grain of salt. Jordan’s perspective is one of many and no one is right 100% of the time. My suggestion to all ethnicity and genders is to listen to people like this and consider what they’re saying whilst also educating yourself with other perspectives. Talk to right wingers, left wingers and people in the centre, however do not blindly follow these people, come to your own conclusions.
He claims that many guys in these high paying positions are ready to give up the family life for their job. In reality that not true at all, most guys in high positions (like CEO) still have family because they don’t share the work in child care equally. For women it’s usually expected that they take on the majority of work in raising children, which is uncompensated work that makes you dependent on your partner. It would be best for all if men would take on more responsibility in raising children, also leads to better relationships
Yikes… I mean I enjoy listening to this guy, he’s got some very interesting knowledge to share… but as a woman in her 30’s who legit doesn’t want to have kids… kind of felt attacked right there with him saying “theres something wrong with women who don’t want to have kids”. Really…? Theres something wrong with not wanting to risk your physical health? To not want to go through the intense pain? And what about just the fact that… sometimes things just didn’t work out. People date and just never find the right one. Whats wrong with just accepting the cards your dealt and being happy either way? In either case my sister is off having a bazillion kids and busy with all the stress of that life while Im left having to take care of whats left of my aging parents. I dont even have time for kids. And I have neices and nefews that love me… bullshit im not maternal… im just not stupid. He definitely speaks out of turn on this. The guy might be intelligent but that doesnt make him the master of all subjects. He lacks personal experience on this one.
He keeps talking about women but he needs to be talking about men too. Why is having children the biggest burden on women. Why isnt having children an equal burden on men AND women. Doesn’t this suggest that the expectations we have for women as part of the family is unfairly much higher than for men?
I agreed with him until he mentioned that women should have children as without children there is a ‘barren future’. That’s something I don’t agree with! He seems of Catholic mentality. As an almost 30-year-old woman working in a global law firm, I never have and never will want to have children. I am happy with my partner, we both don’t want children, I have never felt a maternal feeling inside me, never had desire to become pregnant. This dude needs to accept that some couples simply don’t want children.
honestly, this can be applied to anyone in general. My dad lived a miserable life chasing money. He pressured me for 8 years of my life to work a job that pays 6 figures a year. Now that I’m almost out of high school, he and my mom tell me that if I want, there’s nothing wrong with wanting a job that only pays 50k a year. I don’t believe anyone, man or woman was meant to work 8+ hours a day at a job they don’t enjoy. It’s not healthy and you’ll end up missing out on so many other things in life.
Women and men can be anything they want. They can be career driven or not career driven. But they should make sure what they want. The society expecting men to be career driven is wrong and sometimes causes a lot of trauma in an individual’s life. Also society expecting women to have kids is wrong. Kids are not for everyone. It’s okay to not have kids. If you are a career driven individual, it’s better to not have a family. Because you are damaging your partner’s and kids(especially)lives.how?a family needs to be nourished with love, which requires you to put a lot of time and effort.this goes for both genders. It just doesn’t work that way. It’s not bad to be career driven. In fact it is great and not everyone can do it. This goes for all genders. The most important thing in life is figuring out what you want.growing a kid is such a difficult and intense commitment. I’m not concluding that career driven people cant do that. But you gotta have supernatural powers to do both. It’s mentally destructive.
It’s a shame because this talk stars out so good but can’t you hear how ridiculous you become when you start to claim that basically all women over 30 will desperately want kids and if they don’t there is a very high chance they are simply lying to themselves or there is something fundamentally wrong with their psychology? I can’t believe this was only in 2017, you are a 40 year old guy claiming that if a woman doesn’t want kids there is likely something wrong with them, just listen to yourself for a second.
I agree with JP on a lot of things and appreciate his balanced and data-driven views, but on the topic of women’s role in society I always pick up on this persistent undercurrent of traditionalist bias. I am one of those career women who decided that I don’t want to kill myself for my job, but it’s certainly not because I am suppressing aspirations to be Suzie Homemaker. Instead of claiming that gender imbalance in power is due to power hungry, workaholic men, perhaps consider the insane work culture that we have in our society, and how that puts anyone (men and women) into a life of stress and misery when all they thought they wanted was the American Dream
His conclusion and framework is disgusting. It sounds “respectful” to women, but he stereotypes and distills to a certain genetic behaviour which is so backward.. His conclusion is that there is a catastrophe now because essentially men are now not as qualified as women, but women leave the higher paying positions because they are genetically engineered to have maternal instincts. And oh. If they don’t have these maternal instincts = they have a disagreeable temperament and masculine. So many glossed over stereotypes and sweeping statements.
I will live my life the way I see fit. I teach but I don’t have any children. The fact that he says that your future is barren if you don’t have children doesn’t make sense. I see people who have children and they don’t do anything for them. The children have become unproductive members of society. My sense of self does not come from anything external. If I have children I’m okay. If I don’t I’m okay as well.
The first five minutes of this talk on high-paying jobs is so interesting I couldn’t turn it off. But then it all went off the rails: At 7:45 he describes women who don’t want children as “something that isn’t quite right in the way that they’re constituted…non-maternal, masculine temper, disagreeable, they’re not particularly compassionate…” I know several women in their 50s who chose not to have kids. They are warm, intelligent, outgoing, and they deal with kids daily. Teachers. Nurses. Doctors. They are compassionate, but despite the hard-wired instinct to raise families, they chose to deal with an already challenging life without being responsible for the well-being of children. Having children is a huge responsibility, and many adults can see that clearly even without having procreated. If your wages don’t lend themselves to supporting children, or if you haven’t found the right person to help you, for certain people, that is going to be a drag on their procreation. As with any creature in the jungle, conditions must be right for mating. Not mating doesn’t make people freaks. Studies suggest that upwards of 40% of humans produce no offspring. So why does Professor Peterson dislike childless couples? Mr. Peterson has some genuine insight into how the corporate world wears people of both sexes down, and I love hearing his ideas, but he sounds odd when he talks about those of us who don’t have children. Specifically women who don’t want children. I’ve never heard him chide men for not wanting kids.
I’m one of those weird women I guess. I wanted to have a kid or two and be a housewife since I couldn’t decide on a career choice. Then I got married and had a kid. And I realized being a homemaker wasn’t for me. (I hated it actually. I fell into depression because of it.) I’m 30 now. I am a disagreeable person (but not uncivil) and have always been. And I’m back in school now to become an RN. I want the money and the hour flexibility. Not because I like the thought of being an RN. My biggest regret is that I didn’t get my schooling done before I had a kid. For me it’s about security for my daughter in case something happens to my husband. Oh, and some pocket money. Financial freedom is great.
– I like how instead of questioning why women don’t want stressful high paying jobs, he questions why anyone would want to sacrifice their lives for them. – I hate how he says the inequal representation in high paying jobs is only due to women’s choices and not to workplace sexism. Both are true, a result can have multiple factors. – He talks about how law firms try really hard to recruit and keep women. I’m not a lawyer but I know the same thing happens in tech. Companies want to hire lots of women but they often don’t give them the same credit and money as the men, so obviously they are less satisfied at work and more likely to leave when they have families. – The university system was largely built by men for men, is still mainly run by men and courses taught by men…. Yet now after women learned to navigate the system and outperform them, men are considered ‘failing’ and instead of teaching them to be less entitled we’re supposed to what, overhaul the education system to tailor it to boys even more? – According to Jordan women who don’t want kids are masculine, which implies that it’s natural for men to not want kids. The entire talk treats WOMEN wanting high paying jobs as a problem, even though that possibility allows women a lot on independence and improves their quality of lives. Why doesn’t he spend equal amount of time trying to convince men to be stay at home dads?
I met a woman who had a baby at 19 while on vacation. She stayed for a few years but hated her life and wanted to die. She left her kid thinking she could win custody and now she hasn’t seen her baby in 6 years. She suffers a lot of conflict. I feel bad for her, she’s so nice and yet she has an embarrassing and painful problem.
7:50 disagree with why he equates a non-maternal temperament with a masculine temperament. There is nothing inherently masculine about not wanting kids, and plenty of masculine men are also proudly paternal and make awesome dads. he does make a few interesting points tho generally, but most are anecdotal and opinions rather than statistical or factual it seems
Yup, I can concur with your statements SIR based on my personal experience! You do sacrifice a lot to earn a lot. I used to dream about making $80K per year when I just graduated from a university. I got the pay that I wanted eventually and I wished for $130K for my next job. Then I got greedy and aiming for $180K above since I “needed” to have a few investment properties. And just last year, I had to pay the price. I had no life, I had a poor connection with my toddler son, I wasn’t there when my wife had a miscarriage and didn’t really have time to hang out with the boys. I resigned from that “comfortable” job and now doing the ‘typical’ 9-5 role. We had to sell one of the properties as a result, but life is definitely happier now. I realised that you don’t have to own many material things to be fulfilled and happy. The answer has always been right under my nose, which was MY FAMILY.
I’m the non maternal kind of woman he’s mentioning, 38 and never wanted kids specially now with this crazy world with pandemia and all kinds of difficulties. Im already concerned about myself and the future, I cant imagine how desperate I would be with a kid, its simply too much and not for me. And I think he’s very right about the majority of things BUT I think theres nothing wrong in not wanting kids. Thats a reponsible decision, much more responsible than the many people who’s having kids without really knowing what they are getting into, or just bringing them without having the maturity or necessary means.
I’m a female in a traditional “male” field. There’s always a constant pressure to outperform, publish the most impressive findings and consistently remain on top of my shit to even be considered as an equal or be taken seriously. While defending my dissertation, one of the panel members asked me if I was planning on starting a family and how that would affect my further research/ fellowship. Needless to say I was livid. Unfortunately, this wasn’t the last time I heard of something of this nature. edit: for anyone in the comment section who is comparing corporate jobs with academia clearly has no idea what they’re talking about and should probably not speak on it.
Most American households can’t afford to have kids. Yet if you are a woman everyone will ask if you want one. It’s not that simple. One wage is rarely enough to support a family and daycare is super expensive. Plus the world is over populated and resources are scarce. Theres multiple ways a man or woman who likes kids can contribute to society outside of biological birth. If you have a career and education you can help contribute to fixing these societal problems. Not everyone is cut out to be a parent. Its a tough job and people usually do it more because of life circumstances…met the right guy or it just happened, etc. Maternal instinct was socially constructed a long time ago. Before modern medicine women died in childbirth so they made having a child out to be the pinnacle of a womems great experience to ease thier fears. Also capitalism and the churches love to have costumers. Follow your heart and do whats best for you! There are many paths to a fufilling life.
Lol. How is men underperforming at school a woman’s fault! Like if boys decide not to study cause women are doing well and they think they can just mooch off someone I think that’s super presumptuous. In the same way it’s presumptuous for women to assume that as well. I think everyone, regardless of gender, should be motivated internally to achieve their idea of success, which could be different and not just about being rich, which is another thing that Jordan refuses to address. Additionally, he keeps talking about women “picking high status men” which honestly is only an option for a minority of women who look like Victoria Secret Models. Most women who are average looking or hell even just pleasant but not in a model kind of way mostly have a tough time even finding average men who are sweet and dateable. In Jordans ideal world women would just underperform and wait to be “married” to men who will judge them by superficial standards while guys have an easy time getting into University without competition from “women”. This is just extremely unfair and mysogynist as it means that men are allowed to work hard to change their status in life however women should just be lucky to either be born into wealth or be good looking enough to be gold diggers. I wish the women getting a chance to interview him would ask the right questions to expose this sexist man. That being said he has a lovely voice and very charming demeanor so I don’t blame the majority for being swayed.
I really like having a teacher who says “I don’t know” to a question, it goes to show their lectures are without ego. When the student asks if a woman should have a family before career and someone as educated as Jordan Peterson says he doesn’t know what the answer is, it just reminds me that anyone trying to advise you on how to balance those things doesn’t really know either.
It takes time to adjust to the changes we’ve gone through since the 60’s. I for one am glad that we as men and women have the ability to decide which of us will work and which of us will be the primary caregiver of the children. I don’t agree that everyone should become a parent, another choice we now have. Life is more complex than ever and the old formulas don’t work for everyone. Actually, they never did. But at least today, we can choose.
it’s almost like he’s saying “oh it sucks to be a woman in this field, it’s too much trouble, so you may as well leave because its awful”…. which is such a cop out. Like, men will go through a lot of the same things in terms of work hours, career focus, etc. Why not instead, FIGHT that patriarchal system? Why is the answer “leave and go be an incubator” rather than “stay and change the status quo”.
70 hours a week is nothing! I saw my mom work 100+ hours for most of her life without making that much money. Also being childfree is my choice because I’m one of those women who is not maternal at all and I’ve know since a young age, hes right, why would I bring a child into this world just to have it neglected or not be a my main focus 100% of time.
I love all of the women getting bent out of shape in the comment section due to his “generalizations” Considering I’ve listened to more feminist lectures than I care to admit that basically argued men are fragile, petty and violent creatures who need to stop being so manly, and be more feminine. You guys feel attacked and put into a box? Please…..hold me beer.
So basically: -If you’re a woman and don’t want kids you are immature, have sth wrong with the way you see the world or act like a man. -If you’re a woman in a higher paying position then you sleep 4hs a day cause god forbid your husband takes any of the burden of raising a child. -Let’s question the ppl in positions of power for developing obsessions over their work at the sake of any other personal development instead of questioning the system and the way our society always yells “more, More, MORE” This is him just actively trying to convey the message that women should not even want to strive for professional development… Thanks good Sir, I’ll write everything you said down for future reference in case I develop the insane idea of not wanting kids, or maybe asking my future partner to help out with the kids, or wanting to strive in my profesional career…
I find he makes some very interesting points but contradicts himself sometimes. He often has undertones of patriarchy himself and certainly projects his values in his lectures. Although he made some interesting points here, I think he’s only seeing one side of the story or certainly not seeing all facets of the issues.
Being able to contribute financially to the family, in a developing country like mine is very good for a woman, because it: Ensures you are treated well. You have a say in household matters and how your children are raised. With regards to whether women should opt for having children soon. In my personal opinion earlier is better as there are various health and financial issues that cause a lot of problems. IVF treatments are not cheap.
Very interesting lecture. I must say, I feel there’s a big point being forgotten here as to WHY women feel motivated to have their own career paths in the first place: FREEDOM. We live in a money-based society, there’s no escaping that. Unless you choose to run away & join a commune in the mountains, you’re going to need money to survive. In a perfect world, a female who wished to be a mother would join herself with a working-class male in a legally binding contract where each party agreed to a shared goal of creating a life together. They would treat one another equally and live happily ever after. Unfortunately, we live in an imperfect world where things don’t go as planned and often fall apart. And in WHEN those things fall apart, this particular “perfect” scenario leaves women with the short straw every time. All because her day-to-day efforts weren’t aimed towards a monetary reward. This results in families enduring long-term abuse/neglect because the father became power-hungry and the mother was without alternative options. (IOW, freedom.) These children then grow up perusal this dynamic thinking “I’m not letting this happen to me.” and BAM. Now we’re here with the statistics you just listed. Idk about y’all, but I’d rather have freedom in my own home than be ruled by a man every day of my life. Kids or not.
How fascinatingly accurate. I’ve been one of the lucky ones. Started my career at 25 had my first child at 30. Chose a work place that provided maternity leave. Ect. I did however have trouble with returning to work after with coworkers who where either annoyed by my my absence or resentful of the privileges I had.. Then the real work begins being 100% at work and at home. Husband basically confused about what he was supposed to do. My thirties were exhausting in so many ways. But at 66 I’m retired with a pension have my 2 grown children and a granddaughter. I am interested to what has happened to men in this critical time period.
i find meself disagreeing with some of what he said, and i clearly knitted me brows when i hear his personal bias slipped in. but am also happy that despite those things, am still able to also agree with him on some things. and even things i disagree with him on, didnt automatically paint him as “the bad guy” in me head. basically what am saying is, am quite glad to find that i still have a somewhat healthy and functional brain. 😀
Jesus christ I’ve never seen Peterson this coked out before 😮 That aside, while most women do in fact follow a common life path, he really shouldn’t be preaching that women working and being career-oriented as problematic and impractical. Just because most women follow a common life path doesn’t mean they should be discouraged in seeking out a different one if it makes them happier and more fulfilled. This is really disappointing to see from Peterson.
I’ve never wanted kids. I’m extremely compassionate and empathetic and love animals. I did the education then long hours in corporate America. I’m extremely happy with my two little dogs and keeping in touch with family and friends. I especially enjoy nature, travel and art. Not everyone needs or wants children. Nothing wrong if you do but such sweeping generalizations about children. It’s simply Not true.
It’s interesting how he presents his own observations. His view that a life without a traditional family is “dismal”, and his experience of women being “not quite right” if they choose not to have kids isn’t in any way supported by facts or statistics which is very misleading. Especially when research is actually showing the opposite (see Paul Dolan, professor of behavioural science at LSE)
At work there’s this male colleague, mid 30s, just had his first baby. Is simultaneously being pushed into a leadership position by company which he obviously doesn’t really want. He took Fridays off to be with his wife and child and people looked at him weirdly, some made smug comments. Honestly I feel kinda bad for him. There’s all these expectations, meanwhile it seems he just wants to be more of a family man
No reasonable woman would want the life of a high-paying job and would therefore quit because the man brings more $$$ into the household in the first place… well, maybe it’s not a problem with those womens’ reasoning, but rather the fact that it’s so much more likely and expected for the guy to be the breadwinner and for the woman to make concessions in her career and let the guy assume that role? …alright well, he lost me when he started talking about those inherent maternal urges and shit… I won’t bother trying to rebute such “arguments”. I suppose the life goals and the overall mentality that I have compared to my partner would just be a really extreme exception to the “rules” of human nature according to Peterson.
I admire his brain process. So true when he says most ladies don’t know what they want when they are 19years lol. Most often they say the tagline “I don’t want kids” but later surprise themselves when the lonely single independent woman depression kicks in by 30. Fact is men needs women, women needs men…we weren’t designed to be independent rather dependent on each other..i don’t know why the big battle and rattle for accepting whats meant to be..no wonder society is unstable cos we making it unstable with unstable nonsense.
Where is the science that says men are biologically more competitive than women? What does he have to back up his argument that men BIOLOGICALLY want to work long hours for lots of money and women don’t? To say that this phenomenon is solely based on differences between men and women and has nothing to do with culture is obviously short-sighted. Also who is he to tell someone that it’s a mistake to not have children? I thought this guy stood for individual liberty. Can’t somebody have a purpose or cause in their life that they are passionate about and dedicate themselves to that children would get in the way of?
The female lawyers who quit the high powered firms generally go into corporate law, or get on company boards. They don’t wind up as cashiers at Walmart. They are probably still pulling in six figures, and can hire people to do the home chores they don’t want to do. On another note, just because a woman isn’t maternal, doesn’t mean she is disagreeable; little throw away comment there.
Why should women ‘burn themselves to a crisp’ he is talking about women and childcare and nannies. But he is missing one fundamental point! Men are capable of looking after children as well. Men who are also the biological parents of their children can and should take an active role in childcare. A woman can work and a man can stay at home or men and women can share childcare and work around their careers. He is not even acknowledging the possibility that men can be nurturers. This lecture doesn’t make sense without that acknowledgement.
Watching this at 30, one week away from my maternity leave, thinking that the additional demands of my family might just put the stress of my job in perspective! I agree with what Jordan says, although I imagine there are many men who would prefer to put their family first but feel the need to keep up their high paying job. I feel privileged that I can take maternity leave and bond with my baby. However, I’ve always known I wanted kids. I would’ve had them at 22 if my partner had been ready! We jointly decided to wait until our 30s and we’re in such a better position to raise this child because of that decision we made – both financially and having spent time enjoying our younger years as a couple. This was the perfect time for kids … until covid came along!
I am a Brazilian woman and I am single with no kids. I know personally four long time happily married couples who don’t want to have children. I think they should, as they are great people with strong ethical values, but who am I to judge since I haven’t married or had children of my own? And I also know many working women with kids, but they need a housekeeper and a nanny, otherwise it would be chaos. The people with the best familiar, ethical, financial structure are having less kids. What could be done if anything should be done?
This man is such a delight to listen to. He has so much knowledge n insight to give. U may not agree with everything he’s saying but u can’t deny that he’s bloody brilliant. And honestly he’s not imposing his ideas on any1. He’s just stating what he has observed for years n years of clinical practice and he’s definitely correct. Now u have to decide on ur own which of these tips r applicable to u cuz all our lives r different. An idealistic perfect family doesn’t exist. U decide what u wanna do. Ppl like him r providing u with all the insights n possibilities. U ultimately have to use ur own brains to sought ur life out by utilizing the tips in a practical manner. This man is doing an amazing job to keep us woke. U can’t have everything in life. Gotta sacrifice sumthng in order to gain the thing that’s at the top of ur priority list.
I get his larger point, but I absolutely despise how he speaks for women as universally wanting the same things. Why are being “maternal” and “not wanting kids” mutually exclusive issues? Perhaps he hasn’t considered that women have some agency. Some are maternal but have decided not to have kids for reasons other than not liking children. Also what is the bullshit about women needing to be told what it will be like for them in their 30s? As a women in my mid-30s I can assure you society has been telling me that I will need to balance a successful career and a family since I was a teenager. Every day. I didn’t suddenly realise that it might be difficult to do both when I turned 30. Astonishing how men still feel they have the authority to tell women how they should go about lives, and how they should feel about it. His authority (to talk about women, not this topic) is from “watching women over the decades” as a supposedly objective observer. What patriarchal, colonial, condescending bullshit 🙄
Men should be able to choose what profession best fits their unique personalities, interests, and carefully crafted abilities culminated by complex life experiences and years of reflection. Women’s calling in life is collectively based on their fertility. Got it. “Work gives you meaning and purpose and life is empty without it… except if you’re a woman.” -Stephen Hawking
This is what people don’t get. I’ve honestly heard libs genuinely think that high-paying jobs just involve golfing and sipping on drinks and occasionally making a decision via text from your vacation home. The truth is, most MEN don’t want to deal with these jobs. The reason men do this is because a lot more of their value comes from their salary and career. If anything, it’s sexism AGAINST men. As a woman, I’m told I’m inherently beautiful and valuable just by nature of my existence, and that whatever I choose to do is a valuable contribution to society. Men are told to toughen up and get results. And not that anyone cares, but as a woman who dates men, I would NEVER want anything to do with a guy who is okay with routinely working more than 40 hrs/week. I don’t think having a life that is so focused on ONE THING is worth it. Yeah, you’re glorified for your amazing contributions, but you don’t experience anything else. I want a man who is home, who has time for me, who has time for our kids, and who doesn’t expect me to bear the entire burden of the household on my back. Because I want a 40 hr/week career, too. Jordan Peterson nails it again.
I honestly am fine with paying someone to clean my house, so that non-work time is focused on better things. Im a single mom of 15 yrs. Had my 1st when 18 (not saying I recommend that), went to college in my 20’s, have a great job that I love. I’m not rich, but I make roughly 80k now. If I am ever lucky enough to marry, I would rather we hire people to do mundane chores (I have a cleaning lady), so much less stress and gives someone a job. I’d rather spend non-work time with my family, friends and hobbies. Id want my husband to not have to stress either. Life is short. Dont stress over little things like chores
I’d say he missed the mark. Don’t make your work your life, but also don’t make your kids your life. I’d say that a meaningful life comes from three main things, the people you share it with, something you can do or make, and service to others. These are some of the things that make life great, but that is a broad definition and can vary depending on the person. While these things can add meaning, external accomplishments shouldn’t define your whole existence. You are more than the sum of the things that you do.
Just watch his other articles. You will better understand what he is trying to say. “Epic Rant on gender equality” is one of his articles and although it tackle on same problems with similar examples you won’t be thinking about language. His interview is also other one of good ones. Just try to keep an open mind without clouding your judgment from this article then you will understand where he stands better.
Any person regardless of gender would leave the insanity of high-paying misery as soon as possible, which means as soon as they see through the ruse. Peterson’s describing the ultimate sacrifice job. It’s not a luxury job, it’s a fucking poverty job. It’s not something I’d ever do or want. I’ve found far more autonomy and purpose being an entrepreneur and community-oriented person in nonprofit work.
I think I have an example for this in my own home as my mom, she told me the reason she quit her job at 36 is because she had achieved peace. I never really understood why a woman would give up such well paying job in the law firm to start her own practice. When she was in the company overworked cranky and looking so much older than her age, tired irritated and lacking in her femininity the year after she quit damn my mother looked good and now at 47 she feels so much better than ever. indeed she achieved Peace.
My main problem with what he is saying is that he assumes that being a housewife is somehow more fulfilling and less stressful than an average job. Cleaning and taking care of children is no more fun than having a day job or even a work intensive career. I think that for most people they have a certain amount of usable intelligence, some more than others, and if their daily life does not challenge them enough to equal their intelligence level then they are left bored and unfulfilled. So for many women, especially ones of at least above average intelligence, a job might be something that is desirable as a way to keep their minds active and to make their lives more challenging.
Why are you trying to convince women positions of power are not good because it constitutes “overwhelming responsibility?” Why are you telling them family is important suggesting this doesn’t apply to men? This is nonsense. Saying it’s a catastrophe for women to have a high paying job because they can’t have children at thirty is based on unfortunate assumptions. The society should allow for women to have both family and career, as it has been doing for men for so many years. There are successful women who have children and you dismiss them as though they are “tough and rare.” Maintaining a high paying job can be damn fulfilling and you know it. If it wasn’t, why would men be fighting over it to the extent you are trying to convince the other half of the population out of it? Whether you are a woman or a man you shouldn’t be targeted based on a binary description. Society should allow for both happy women and men. You just sound like you would be comfortable securing power jobs for men and keeping them in power, “running business,” trying to convince women it’s smarter to opt out. Power is something that is good to have rather than not, buddy. But nice try.
Go into The Trades professions: plumbing, concrete, masonry, electrical, hvac, carpentry, landscaping, horticulture, agriculture,… And then the for those who are well suited to the various other professions, more sedentary type positions,…. do those. All types have jobs/professions/careers well suited for them.
Women who don’t want kids at some point usually have something wrong with them? Well, I know a few of those and there is nothing wrong with them. I think these are a bunch of very eloquently told generalizations that are overwhelmingly appealing to male audiences. No need to dispel women from the utopian fantasy of a career instead facing disappointment at 30. Let them face that disappointment and change their mind if they see fit. Western women are now living in average 80 years, and the ability to safely give birth has raised to nearly 40. What’s the rush? By the way, before someone starts name calling me and categorizing me as a SJW, I have no problem accepting that women and men are on average different. It’s not a new idea whatsoever. My problem is self-determination: a career, even if one decides to later stay home, can be intellectually very rewarding. Why demonizing it?
Mr.Peterson, why aren’t u settling for a $60K/annum salary. U make what I earn in a fortnight! Why is it okay for you to be granted so many opportunities, to be a high paid being a high paid earner, a multi millionaire, but not for women? I appreciate many of your theories and arguements, but I definitely do NOT appreciate that you are a misogynist.
You’ve basically described me as somehow mentally unstable because I don’t have and didn’t want children. Hello? Sorry – is this The Handmaid’s Tale? You know, if men can choose to be single – so can woman. Just because I’m biologically capable doesn’t mean it’s my destiny. Have you considered the DRAMATICALLY declining marriage rates? We are faced with a generation of men who are eschewing marriage, so the choice for many women is a non-choice. Studies on groups struggling economically reveal that women, not men, are the ones deferring marriage for the sake of financial stability. Become a single parent and live on the breadline or remain childless. For many- that’s the choice.The issue is more complex that the argument presented here.
You lose 2 most valuable things in life which is your time and freedom. I chose to work work myself and it wasn’t easy to achieve that financial freedom and I’m nearly there. I’ve decided to be comfortable then rich. I’ve decided to be happy and create my own.. There’s nothing wrong with the struggle and getting to the top but for what cost? If you can spend soo much time and effort then invest in yourself. I know lawyers who started a different career and started a business with less stress and made more money then they would have working 60 70 hours a week for some corporate law film and making them rich. Men and women are not the same. Men and women are equal but different. Why would a woman want to be equal when she is superior? She’s a mother,sister, wife and much more. She doesn’t need to change tyres and lift weights but unfortunately men dont take better care for there woman so woman have to do everything and it’s sad to see. You dont have to agree to this comment. I come from a culture which teaches men to be men and take on responsibility. If your reading this I wish you happiness first then success. Make sure you balance your life, make sure you invest in yourself with an open mind, don’t be afraid to fail and lose, take the calculated risks and have faith. Don’t give in to tunnel visions step back try something different and new…. and see what happens….
What family life? Most families today are broken and some are remade artificially out of shards. Also you got it the other way around regarding the dedication of men and women to families and career. There is a minority of men who are crazy about career, but almost all women are like that. If women give up on their career in their thirties is not because they are wise but because they cannot compete with the male psychopathic workaholics. It is men who usually put family above career. Men work in order to have a family. Women make a family when they cannot afford a career. The world is crazier than you think.
This is exactly the Bible.. I spent 15 years working as a Lawyer at a Lawyer’s highly reputable Firm until I felt I couldn’t cope any longer with Not having a life..I could have stayed there for the rest of my life but to me, getting higher Profesionaly was parallel to getting lower as an alive person,.. and as a mother, having to, as it was perfectly described in this article, have to fight with relentless working hours plus all the errands “due to a wife” was simply not worth it! From outside things are seen completely different than from inside.. I left because I wanted but above all because I could. Not one day has passed since I left that I had not felt the relief of been financially ( imensilly) poor but so rich in terms of Life. Blessed.
A lot (not all) of women in this comment section cannot understand the difference between general patterns and observations and their personal experience. This man has something like 30+ years of direct clinical counseling experience, as well as many years conducting and looking at studies of people. I think his knowledge on this subject is broader than yours. But yeah, you’re a woman and wanna work 80 hours a week so most women must be just like you. Btw, fair warning: most men, especially the type of men you want, do not give a crap about your career. Just the hard truth.
Raising kids in the 21st cen. IS NOT like in the 90s-, it’s FREAKING exspensive!!! What do you guys want us to do? Stay home and live in the cycle poverty because only one person work? Get a rich man and be called a shameless fucking gold digger? Go to work and be a labeled as a failing parent? Wtf is life? Aight imma just die YEET! EDITED: 2025: *Rate of women committed suicide has rise up to 100%*
I respect women who want to be housewives and take care of their children. My mother’s a housewife and I think that’s a respectable job. Raising children is just as hard or even harder than working. I also respect women who decide to focus on their career and not have children until they want to. I don’t like the side of modern feminism that shames housewives and I don’t like those who shame career-focused women either.
There’s parts of this that are true. The most recent data says the happiest people make about $80-85k a year. That said, greater financial freedom can make a person happier beyond 60 or 80k. It just depends what a person is giving up for the excess money and how they’re making it. If a person likes their job at 60k and then gets another job they equally like, working the same amount of hours, etc making $250k they’ll prob be a bit happier. To Jordan’s point it comes down to figuring out how to make more while maintaining balance within your life.
Overly dramatic. I’m a fairly high paid working Mum who works 30-40 hours a week and is able to blend it just fine. Many career women work part time, but even full time Mums are just fine with a thing called childcare. You CAN have it all and still be a great Mum/ partner. He is referencing a very rare number of people- who work 70 hours.
I grew up in the 80s right when the whole hardcore original feminist agenda had seeped throughout most of academic middle class. My whole school life from elementary school to university was a non-stop lecture of “Girls, you can do anything. No, not enough. You SHOULD do everything. Not having a carreer on you own is bad. Depending on anyone in your life is bad. Enjoying anything or showing any characteristics likes and dislikes that could even remotely be considered a stereotype for your gender is bad. Go become an engineer. Go into politics. Go become a business woman. Don’t get children too early. Don’t think you have to be a mother.” And it’s not like you only got this lecture from teachers, no, you get it from your peers all the time as well. I can’t count how often I was scolded by a fellow female student in the uni for allowing my then significant other to treat me to anything (“That’s so conservative. Be a bit independet.”) Well, awesome if you are interested in all these things and if that’s who you are and who you want to be. All power to you. But I never was that, I never will be that. All I ever wanted was a job, that I can do well and efficiently and that contributes to sustaining my/our household while also not stressing me out too much and giving me enough time to persue my personal interests (like learning languages and all kinds of random stuff), to enjoy a stable relationship and to eventually have a real family too (plus a dog and a cat possibly) and enjoy helping and seeing my children grow.
I have watched a lot of Jordan Peterson and like him, but let us remember that he is a man of a certain generation talking about young women as if they are all 19-year-old, privileged students lacking life experience and knowledge of their ancestors. Some of his INTERPRETATIONS REFLECT THE COLONIZER. In another article he talked about the dragon from a colonial (versus indigenous) perspective. Indigenous people understand hierarchy just like him, but their interpretation of the dragon differs. The dragon is a woman, more precisely the earth herself, the ground on which we stand, the integrated response, our fears, our shadow. The only sustainable way to respond is through acknowledgement and respect. The fear should not elicit a kill and cut into pieces response. The treasure she holds is peace and plenty. Peterson’s INTERPRETATIONS ARE INCOMPLETE, and he is influencing the men who make themselves available to women today. I think the men are better for it (and they certainly need some guidance), but will they try to tell their partners that having a career isn’t realistic? They need to look beyond Peterson for interpretation and uplift the dreams of women in their life. What does Jordan Peterson have to say about the many American who choose to have children without the accompaniment of a man? Why does he FAIL TO DEFINE career work vs job work (does it come down to hours and predictable schedules or meaning itself?) He said in another article that women can’t have careers while raising families.
This is true. My wife is a director in an insurance firm. I work part time and look after our child and sell my craft stuff. I wouldn’t want her job. I couldn’t be doing with her level of stress. I’d rather have my shit pay and have freedom of movement. She’s 43 and is trying to be an efficient mum to a 4 year old, a Director, working long hours, and a decent wife but it just doesn’t work. She’s not doing anything wrong from a moral point of view as in she’s working hard which is good, and trying to be a good mum with but the reality is, the 3 componants of her life just don’t mix.
I would love to know what he thinks of people who are gay? Coz apparently not wanting to have children means that there is, “Something wrong” As a psychologist he shouldn’t be interjecting his personal, outdated beliefs into his teachings. He discouraging women’s free thought and independent expression. I laughed at his panic, displayed over more women people in University than man. You know how long it took for women to be allowed attend University and have a career? He reminds me of the bloody church.
I want children, I became pregnant at the age of 22/23 and I had to abort for 3 reasons, 1) I am tapering off of a high dose of Klonopin and I can’t quit CT, I don’t want to risk giving my child a birth defect. 2) I am not financially ready to have a child, I work a 40hr workweek at a decent paying job and I can barely sustain myself. 3) My partner didn’t want a child at that time, and I didn’t want my child to be raised in a broken home like I was. I constantly feel demonized for this. It will always haunt me, deep inside I wanted that child more than anything.
I’m 37, having children is not an ultimate life goal. Trust me, it’s the hardest thing you will do in life and they are your children forever. Then there are grandkids. I have one kid and I was left to raise her on my own. It’s incredibly difficult and more and more men are just up and leaving their responsibilities. It’s not always worth it, you don’t need to have kids, your genes are not any better than anyone else’s.
I think this is too black and white. That’s to say there is a right way to live that people should follow. Perhaps there is, but I think so much of life is merely how we perceive it. If you believe something it can make a world of difference. For instance if you believe that married life and kids are a headache and the world already has too many people then you might think why have more kids. That is a selfish thing if it’s just to make yourself happy. I listen to many of these articles by Jordan Petersen and I’m sure he knows a lot more about these things than I do. I’m sure he has helped many more people in his life. None the less I can’t believe there is one right path to living life like have friends, have family, and have a purposeful job. Perhaps it is true, but if that is the case then people in bad situations would never be able to be happy. Much of happiness is often based on perspective and the quality of life of other people around you. If you feel you have less then you will likely feel worse. This is the main problem with the hierarchy system. It means that certain people have more value then others. It also promotes making money above all else. I think Buddhists have shown you don’t really need that much in life to be happy.
I fall into this scenario. I had a great career in IT. I got married and wanted kids, and I want to actually get to raise my kids, not a nanny. After getting pregnant it was so hard to quit, but I loved my family more than my job. It was a great decision as far as quality of life, but we had to downgrade financially quite a bit. I am going to have my 4th kid next year. By the time this kid is in school, I will have been out of the work force about a decade. It has changed a lot. I have changed a lot. I think it would be a struggle just to get my old job back. (it’s a very competitive company to get hired at.)
I work in an extremely competitive, aggressive and dangerous industry. It has zero females in many of the roles and for good measure too! All the blokes in leadership positions are either ex military, 50+ years old, ex underground miners and come from other dangerous industries. There are so few 20 something that last, they just break. The 30 somethings leave when they want a family. I’m very glad there are no women, I couldn’t imagine my sister or partner working there.
The problem becomes clear from 9:00 minutes onwards. The scenario of women starting her day at 5:00and ending nearly at midnight everyday and dealing with sick kid, where is the father?? And again at 11:00 again, there is nothing great about a job(I understand what he is trying to say here is that it is a means to meet ends for most people) then why men should hold it.
Prof. Peterson says that it is not clear whether or not there is an advantage for women to wait till mid 30s or later for children. While a secure income and assets are very important, human biology is also important. He never mentioned the fact that maternal mortality starts to rise significantly at 35, as well as maternity-induced chronic medical conditions. There are also increasing rates of infant mortality and genetic and congenital defects. A 38 year old body, and especially a 38 year old egg are very different from those 15 years younger. Of course, testes also accumulate defects with time, so the risk of using a man’s sperm increases with age, You also can’t expect a person, male or female, who has devoted their life to dominating and managing a business to be emotionally or physically present, or magically acquire the empathic and cooperative skills necessary for a mutually supportive partnership and a healthy family life.
I want to listen to women in high paying jobs talking about women in high paying jobs instead of this guys’ rant. This Professor, a men in a high paying job, is shouting, overbearing and frightening young women with horror scenarios that might happen to some but not all people. Thank you Prof. Peterson but it is untrue that guys or babies are factors that automatically lead to an enjoyable life for a women. Whether we girls enjoy our life or is only up to ourselves. If we are unhappy in the job, just for your information, we can quit. And by the way. Just because of the reason that some women decided for a high paying job in the past, these jobs are slowly changing. Women transformed work places in the sense that some higher positions are “more flexible”, for example possible as part time jobs or flexible hours arrangements, which was more rigid when only men entered those jobs. Especially the part time or dual leadership possibilities are a benefit for the work-life-balance of men and women.
Your assumption on women not wanting children is quite hurtful. You don’t know what some women went through in their early lives or in their lives as an adult even. If a woman doesn’t feel maternal, it doesn’t mean she doesn’t like children. They are many reasons for it and one of them could be simply a preference just as some people prefer the colour blue instead of black. Being a woman is being first of all, and she can choose who she wants to become and what to do with her body – of course assuming she lives in a society that allows self-expression. It is disrespectful to think women are solely children-making machines… that speech makes me vomit.
8:16 As a woman facing the predicament he’s describing, I SOOO appreciate his humility in answering and his transparency about the complexity of the problem leading to his reluctance to give an answer. As the guy asking the question shows, a lot of my male peers think after hearing this “Oh! Well then the answer should be obvious-women should just do XYZ” And it’s not that simple…we don’t always find the right man to have children with right away (Hard for a man to see, as he always overestimates his competition on the sexual market), sometimes we got too much indoctrination from female family members who were burned by men and bitter telling us to “not rely on a man” and “make your own money-babies can wait” (which as a man, he would never be privy to those conversations) and on top of that, some of us women have abusive families and no alternate options of other people who will take us in, so we are forced to develop careers (as a man, who has a provider instinct, it can be mind-blowing to think that a hot, sexually attractive woman would have no one to take her in, but believe it: sometimes the hotter you are, the less a female relative wants you in the house around her husband, and if you are a moral, religious girl, cohabiting is out, so it can be a real problem avoiding the development of a career so you can focus on finding a man to marry). It’s for these reasons, I so much appreciate JP’s answer…he understands these factors and most young men don’t. (No shade intended guys, I firmly believe the patriarchy is a myth and love you all dearly)
Peterson never offers stats, sources, resources, etc. His whole dynamic is “It is if I say it is” Watch how many times in other articles he says “They say”, “The consensus within my field is…” “It is said,” “It is generally agreed.” Huge red flag and huge logical black hole(s). Not arguing with the picture he paints about the workforce; brutal, competitive, dishonest, cutthroat, non-stop work, etc… It is a light-speed treadmill where men and women alike just get hammered. Did it for 10 years, then did a 180 and now I am a real estate developer. Making WAY MORE MONEY than I ever did on the corporate ladder.
This guy makes sooo many generalizations and explains through simplistic narratives. Plenty of men think this way too. Why are you are so hell bent on thinking women and men only think one way. Ever heard of socialization? Social structures aren’t set in stone. In most early societies women were the ones organizing and managing living situations while the men just went out and hunted and gathered and the job was just bringing in material needs…what if I argued that it is natural for women to manage and be in charge of social structures and management and we just leave men to the handy work.
Im 21, and i see it with girls my age. Society gets them when they are young, beautiful, and happy. They then convince them to place career over family. And they could not possibly fathom a world where they are rich and successful at forty, but lonely and miserable. We need the government to get out, and real moms to teach their daughters to respect men and themselves, and accept gender roles. Edit: I just finished the vid, and i didnt realized that he essentially said what i just said, sorry about that. Im happy to hear that he mentioned that we need to really start teaching these women, cause he is right.
Our Education system needs to be changed, it is over 100, yrs old. Children have no idea where apples come from or what chickens look like. Men, as well as women are Required to raise children. Our society needs to change. A community is necessary to raise children. Every home needs a garden, with non gmo food. Apprenticeship needs to become the norm. Our society is broken😔
That concept of a single income household sustaining itself was really only viable in the 1950s north america, where abundance was at a ridiculous high. At no point since, or probably before, such a small amount of people had such a large amount of resources. I could only imagine the amount of mutual resentment such an arrangement would generate over years or decades now, if it was done, not out of choice, but of cultural norms.
Jordan Peterson you are a fucking legend and I am so glad you gained infamy with your anti-gender debate at that campus protest last year. Through your increasing presence on youtube I’ve learned so much from you. and feel more like some of my own opinions are validated, because you as a professor put the points forward so well. Bravo!