Should Vocational Training Be The Exclusive Aim Of A University Education?

I came to Germany from the states in the 90s to study (because HEY! free tuition!) with the ultimate goal of working in the event industry. I found out that my skill-set was much better suited to vocational training, so I switched from the Uni to an apprenticeship and certified after two and a half years (I as well opted to shorten my apprenticeship) as an electrician. Fast foward – I did my Meister in Event Lighting (Meister der Veranstaltungstechnik) and now work as Technical Director in a civic hall, where I have my own apprentices. Not bad for a “college drop-out”!

Germany also provides something that is called “the 3rd education track”. (brace yourself, this gets messy). I have been first to “Hauptschule”, cause my Mom didnt care fore the selection process in the first place. However, at the end of the Hauptschule I wanted to go on to Realschule. That is possible and its called “the special 10th grade”. This was even a specialized Economic School “Wirtschaftsschule” that is placed on the level of a Realschule. After successfully finishing it, I did an apprentice ship in a Bank. Cause i have been to a Wirtschaftsschule I was even considered like someone who had Abitur from the Gymansium cause my economic knowledge was so enhanced compared to the general Realschule. For the record, my math was very bad cause of that, cause i only had financial math and bookkeeping. Well, I finished the apprenticeship and then the 3rd education track was open to me. There is something called “Berufsoberschule” (vocational highschool). You could do there the 12th and 13th grade. (meaning the apprenticeship counted as the 11th grade). With the 12th grade, which i did, you have a specialized titel to go to university of applied sciences. With the 13th grade and a 2nd foreign language you can have the general Abitur and study even medicine … So I did the 12th grade cause i knew I wanted to do “informationsystems and management” (Wirtschaftsinformatik), which is a mix of business and IT. At the time it was only available at the university of applied sciences (or the military which i ruled out).

A big problem in North America is how apprentices go through their apprenticeship. I am from Germany, had my electrical 3 1/2 year apprenticeship and worked until the age of 29 as a journeyman in Germany. We then immigrated to Canada. Here I was on a fast track… very much thanks to my german education in my apprenticeship and the way it has been done. After 2 years foreman/supervisor, another 3 years later Project Manager for huge projects. In my talks with canadian apprentices, and I think the US system is very similar, I learned how it is structured. You accumulate hours on the job and have your x-weeks of school block for each apprentice year (which is a problem in itself, since it is one theory-learning-block and not mixed with the onsite experience in a weekly fashion of that apprentice year). A lot of North American-apprentices take their sweet time because they are focusing on the mighty dollar and hours and delay the school blocks. I met some third year apprentices that were third years for 4 years already. Because they like the money of the third year salary but do not want to take on the responsibilities of a journeyman. You cannot delay your apprenticeship like that in Germany. It is one year after the other… no delaying (except if you are sick or similar life events and then there are some exceptions. But in general a 3 1/2 year apprenticeship takes that time exactly (if finals are passed. If not, 1/2 year gets added until you are eligible for the next exam.) Now in regards to the North American quality of electrical apprenticeship.

I’m from Slovenia and I studied Turism in a vocational highschool. It was great:) A lot less maths and we learned three languages. You really can study anything, not just how to be a plumber or a carpenter. You can even study something like flower arrangment or being a chef or a waiter. It’s great and you can still change your mind and go to university if you want.

Couple of things I can contribute to this topic from a german perspective: – The “stigma” of not achieving your Abitur and going to University is actually growing in Germany too. We actually have a problem with to many people trying to go to Gymnasium and then the university, regardless of their actual “intellectual capacity” or skill in trade job fields. Our Handelskammern are complainig for years that they get less and less trainees each year. – While it is possible to change ways from university to vocational training and the other way around there is still a stigma attached to it. Mainly the “downgrade”. Maybe mainly among the HR people or it’s just a german (work) culture thing, but you tend to be looked at strange it you don’t finish what you started. I made my Abitur, went to University, noticed that it wasn’t really for me after 1 1/2 years and started to apply for my Ausbildung. One of the biggest problems, all the HR people actually had in my job interviews, was mostly this “stain” on my résumé. – While it is correct that many people stay with their training company in the long term, there is also the other side of the coin: The companies and colleagues sometimes keep treating people as if they’re still trainees even after they finished their training. One of the most heard advices I got while beeing a trainee was basically “finish your training, then change the company and start fresh”. Can’t say it was wrong either, because exatly that happened to me. After I changed the company the problem immediately vanished in the new company because everybody there just knew I had the same Ausbildung as them, so I should know what I was doing and was their equal.

I know a lot of my fellow Germans see the distinction between the Gymnasium, Real- and Haupt-/Mittelschule in the intellectual achievements of the students or their potential for that. I think however that this is a real problem, and we should put more emphasis on calling them schools for different types of skillsets. Not sure, if i could make my message clear so let’s give an example: A lot of Germans think the intelligence of a child is the metric after which you should choose the secondary education. But as you can guess no mom or dad would like to admit that their child is less intelligent than other children, so they all try to send their kids to the Gymnasium. This can result in severe pressure in children. If, however, you said that the schools are for different skill sets, nobody would need to be ashamed. A highly skilled craftsman isn’t held in less regard than a skilled administrative worker or an engineer.

So for my educational path, I went to Gymnasium and after my Abitur, I wasn’t really sure what to do next. Therefore I applied for an apprenticeship as a cabinet maker (Tischler/Schreiner) and found a really good small company. The vocational training was planned for three years with at first 3 days at work and two days in school, where I met other students from other companies. This exchange with other students in other companies is very important to check for yourself if your employer treats you right, which is otherwise not so easy because you don’t have any experience or reference. From year to year the amount of school get less, to let you get more work experience. I chose to shorten the apprenticeship to only two years after a half year. This was possible because I had good grades in school and my employer supported me. The final exam then consists of two parts. An exam about all the things you’ve learned in school (of which I had to learn the content of one year by myself), and a skills test which also consists of two parts. The first part of this is a full day of work, where every apprentice has to build something according to a plan they get in the morning. The second part of the skills test is your personal “Gesellenstück” which is something you want to build. There are several requirements for this project, which has to be planned by yourself (including a very detailed CAD drawing) and then approved by a committee, consisting of teachers and employees of local businesses.

It’s not just Germany, it is an alemannic thing. Austria and Switzerland have very similar systems. And one important point to make: the vocational trainings involve also a large number of white collar jobs, many of them with specialized continued learning tracks. If the US were to reinvest into its vocational training, two of the biggest possible mistakes would be to neglect jobs like accounting, and to not involve trade unions, chambers and companies.

When I grew up in germany the mindset was that if you – as a student – had an “academic mind” meaning being good at learning and memorizing, you should go to the gymnasium to persue an academic career. But if you were good with your hands building things and being better with “hands on” you should persue a vocational training. I was always the academic mind so I went to university and did a phd. Because I am bad with “hands on” work I could not teach my son but we were open for him to go on to choose a different path. But he realized early that persuing a vocational training meant to start working for real so he went on the academic path as well. The tendancy towards college or univerity exists in germany as well as a university education still promises a better paid 8-16 job with no dirty hands. The situation might be better than in the U.S. but the problems are there as well.

I finished my Abitur at the top 10% of my class. But as I had no motivation to go on a “School-Path” in university, I started an appranticeship as a freight-forwarder. Now 10 years later I worked in 3 different agencies and am now the leader of the shipping department in a middlesized company. I earn more money than a big part of my friends who went to university at this point (about 4600 Eur/month). Of cause my parents would have veen glad if I went to study something after school, but I think I made the best choice.

Just as a side note: With a vocational qualification it is still possible to attend university later. Personally, I did go to university, failed horribly and made my qualification later. Today, I am one out of two without a university degree in my organisation, called a “nerd” and being one of comparatively few experts in my area of work. Fun fact: When my son did the three week internship in our city’s “Bauhof”, he was the only one from a Gymnasium who had ever done this (and he later went to uni). In this time he made the comment that students from the Gymnasium later plan the buildings (architects), students from Realschule build them (contruction workers) and students from Hauptschule clean them later on (cleaning staff, often regarded as least qualified in Germany). Although this view might insult some people, it is very true. We can’t all be architects, someone needs to build our houses (dreams) and maintain them.

Terrific article. It was a generalization in regard to the US system. I believe it to be impossible to explain the multitude of possible scenarios a person may face as a student in the U.S. as it relates to schools and trades education opportunities. I am a tradesman. I am an electrician by trade but here in the U.S. this can mean very different things based on your training. I did not have formal training but what is referred to as O.J.T. “On the Job Training”. Due to this my skill set is very specialized to a specific set of things. My experience is in an industrial setting with emphasis on control systems and instrumentation for motor control systems. Programmable Logic Controllers and SCADA systems. Associated with that is electrical experience in power systems from 5 volts to 14000 volts. Used in most industrial settings. I have worked for union and non-union companies. I make a very good salary as an hourly employee. It definitely is looked down on by most people to be a tradesman and you are considered to be of low intelligence and low pay. In my personal experience in the area where I grew up and in those in which I found work, trades or vocational schools were non-existent or required a hopeful tradesman to pay a tuition to attend. In my youth there were limited trades classes taught in high school. Which in recent years have vanished from my hometown high school and many other high schools. They do focus all their energy in these schools on sending kids to college and university and leave the other kids to fend for themselves.

I stumbled across your website today and I really enjoy your content! As a German who is currently finishing their vocational training as an office management clerk my biggest advice for anyone starting a vocational training is to not believe that you are less than. Prior to my vocational training I was a university student studying musicology and all of my friends from uni or high school were getting their first or second bachelors or masters degree. I didn’t qualify for financial aid as a university student and due to covid my parents weren’t able to support me financially anymore. Since you’re only allowed to work 20 hours per week as a full time student I wasn’t able to earn enough money to pay for all of my expenses. Quitting uni and starting an apprenticeship was the only way to be able to earn a little more, which is now just enough to get me by. Starting the apprenticeship I felt horrible because comparing myself to my peers growing up (I went to a very expensive boarding school in the Black Forest) gave me the impression that I didn’t amount to anything and that I was a complete failure for having to start an apprenticeship at the age of 23. Into my training at work I realised that most of my superiors didn’t go to university directly after high school but did vocational training first and then got their university degrees. So everything is still possible after completing my apprenticeship. You also earn more money working while studying at university if you have a vocational degree to start with, vocational school doesn’t have to be the last step in your education.

Greetings from Austria! We do have the same education system like our neighbours Germany. You might missed out one part of the blue collar jobs. It’s called “Meister”, after your apprenticeship (and some years of experience) you can attend masterclass, becoming, after passing a commission’s examination, a “Meister” (Master of your profession). This Meister is a equivalence to Bachelor, according Bologna process. And I did two apprenticeships and a master diploma in my current occupation. And yes, salaries are higher with diploma and have higher reputation.

I watched a couple of articles some time ago, all about implementation of this system in some American states (i am sure Senator Sanders had it for Vermont but I am not sure if it is still in effect), mostly in areas where German (mostly automobile/automotive) companies where seated. In one article they had also Japanese, American and Canadian companies involved in the process and they worked closely with the American branch of the Deutschen Handelskammer, especially to get validated certificates after graduating and to keep up the same standards as in Germany (so participants would even be able to get a job in Germany or in case of the branch closing they could end their apprenticeships in Germany). Oh, and as a couple others already said, “Abitur” not “Arbitur”.

Nach meiner Kenntnis ist das Schulsystem in den USA – wie in Deutschland – durch die Gesetzgebung der Einzelstaaten geregelt. Deshalb gibt es dort teilweise sehr anspruchsvolle Eingangsprüfungen bei den Colleges und Universitäten die nicht jeder schafft . Darüber hinaus verlangen die besten Universitäten extrem hohe Studiengebühren. Für “Handwerksberufe” gibt es keine mit Deutschland auch nur annähernd vergleichbare Ausbildung. In Deutschland sind die “Meisterprüfungen” des Handwerks den Bachelor-Abschlüssen der Hochschulen gleichgestellt.

I just want to point that it highly depends on the job if your level of education “doesn’t matter” (or is as respected as others) as you said. Two examples, positive and negative: friend of mine finished Hauptschule and started the same job as me. Because he’s a very competent software engineer and had a good company who supported him, he’s now a software architect in a large company and earns a third more than me (got my Abitur, started studying Computer Science in Freiburg but never finished and had my vocational education afterwards). That’s the positive one. The negative one was when I asked a boss of mine if I could become project manager. Short answer: “No, because you haven’t a university degree!” To quote my father who was First Sergeant in the Bundeswehr and is also a trained master electrician: “If you want to know something, ask an officer. If you want the job done, ask a sergeant.” In my opinion, especially in technical jobs a higher education is preferred over a vocational education. Even if the employee with the vocational education has the higher expertise in the field. My point here is: yes, the german educational system is very flexible (but also freaking complicated) to achieve any kind of degree. But I believe we developed this “white collar jobs are better” attitude as well and don’t see that people with vocational education/ a degree from a Fachhochschule (I believe this is comparable to the american technical college you mentioned) can be as competent as someone with a university degree 🙂

It used to be the way in Germany that employers hired mainly graduates from Hauptschule or Realschule for apprenticeships because who ever went to the Gymnasium wanted to go to university or college afterwards. Then it changed and employers hired mainly graduates from Realschule or Gymnasium because Hauptschule students could apparently not live up to the employers’ requirements anymore. Nowerdays just a few students attend Hauptschule because they hardly have a chance to find a job afterwards. Now more and more students want to go to college and companies have problems to find a student as an apprentice anymore, mainly for crafts. And all companies now whine about the lack of Facharbeiter (skilled workers).

I was told by my guidance counselor I wouldn’t amount to anything. My family wasn’t wealthy enough to send me to university, my grades weren’t good enough to buy a scholarship. So, I joined the military. After my stint, I went to a vocational school paid for by Uncle Sam. Later, I attended a small Community College and earned an A.S. Today I work at a small company, live a comfortable life, own a home, etc. etc. I like to think, I proved my guidance counselor wrong.

Excellent analysis – this is quickly becoming one of my favorite websites. I wonder how the social stigma associated with non-college degrees contributes to the increasing polarization in the US – if a significant proportion of the population feels (and is) undervalued, is it surprising that we see a lashing out at the ballot box, leading to the election of populists promising to restore greatness? Especially paired with economic trends disfavoring the non-college educated and no appreciable safety net…

Fun fact…some german companies, mainly car manufactoring, that set up branches in the US, had significant problems finding skilled workers. Their solution in the end was to built up a VET system german style on a lokal level. I’d guess this is what it would take for the US to change into that direction. The companies organizing the whole thing and then pressuring the state governments into it. Considering how over competitive US companies seem to be…I don’t think this is going to happen anytime soon…😏

A teacher once told me: “You can’t build a house with 50 architects.” That statement really stuck with me. You need trade jobs as much as the academic jobs for a functioning economy. Today, I look at people with vocational training with the upmost respect and value the expertise and experience that come along with such a training. I fully acknowledge that there is a need for a university education but to believe that an academic career is the only path is a dangerous misconception. However, in Germany especially after 1968 there was a tendency to emphasize the academic track. I guess this is why my teacher – back in the early 90‘s – made the statement above. Nowadays I see three major tracks of education at least in my industry: vocational training, duale Hochschule “dual college” and the university track. So maybe you want to take a closer look into the duale Hochschule System as well to further broaden your understanding of the educational system in Germany. In short, duale Hochschule means that a company hires a student. The student pursues an academic program for in total 3 years, e.g. at the duale Hochschule Baden-Württemberg (DHBW). However, within these three years the student also works in the company learning the trades of his profession directly. In the end you end up with a professionally trained academic that knows his way around in the company.

Your articles are very thought provoking and take me back to when I was a German resident back in my mid 20s (around 1985). Bye the way, I think you meant to say controversial – much akin to health care, at minute 1:50! But I must say, your articles are easily the most comprehensive I’ve seen regarding life in Germany. Much better than perusal giggly teenage girls talk about the differences between the American and German dating scene during their exchange student experience. Actually I’m wondering how much preparation you stick into some of these articles. My goodness, not to sound over patronizing, but I’d even give you a PhD just for the content on this website! I remember metal/wood shop in junior high. It’s been outsourced to vocation schools that charge extra money. In other words why leave the young-adult education segment unexposed to commercial activity? If there’s a buck to be make, then it should be made for goodness sake! I used to make fun of some of my German friends who were in enrolled in apprenticeships that had $20 names (Einzelhandelskaufman) but only $5 salaries. I don’t believe that all jobs should require vocational training and working in a supermarket is one of them. But, I do believe the German system is much more superior to that of the US system where high-school grads are herded into college to pursue worthless degrees that are inferior to most of the skilled technical training a person would receive in an apprenticeship. Not to mention the level of debt pursuing a worthless degree can saddle a person with!

The German school system is more differenciated than in your description. Beside the Abitur, the “Allgemeine Hochschulreife” that enables any kind of University studies, there is also the “Fachabitur” after 12 years in different kinds of Gymnasiums (Gymnasium, Wirtschaftgymnasium, technisches Gymnasium) . After 12 years with Fachabitur you can study at a University of Applied Sciences without the classical Abitur. There are more and more special study courses called “Duales Studium” a mixture of vocational training and studies. This makes sense as most trade areas get more and more complex with hightec etc. and to encourage young people to enter these fields by offering development perspectives that are more attractive than the classical “Ausbildung”.

Basically you are also able to go make Abitur even though you come from Haupt/Mittel- or Realschule. With enough job training and the Meister degree or Technician you are also able to go to a Fachschule to get a university degree in that field you were already working in. Even though you just had your Hauptschule finished at the age of 16 and was not sure what “school” means to you. It is not always easy to switch a certain path. It depends a lot on your surrounding, people etc. But is is possible.

Hi Ashton, Hi Jonathan, a short Info. BMW startet a German Like vocational Training in their factory in Spartanburg, because they could Not find enough skilled workers. There some YouTube-Videos about this Programm. Also, I Just recently found your YouTube-Channel and I have to say you do an excellent Job. So I will make a Black Forst-Marathon today, perusal all your articles.😅 Best regards and have a nice Sunday! Ralf

One thing you didn’t mention and which imho is pretty central to the vocational system being seen as equal, is the fact how permeable the system is also later on. My experience is with the swiss system but it is afaik pretty similar to the German one. So one thing is that almost any vocational training allows you to study at a Fachhochschule in a subject relevant to your education. E.g. as a cook or baker you could study food chemistry. Also in Switzerland many students actually finish Berufsmaturitätsschule (BMS) while doing their vocational training. This allows you to study at all FHS and with an additional exam also at all universities. Another thing is that vocational training doesn’t only include typical blue collar jobs but also things like draftsman or programming. In these fields I’d argue you actually have an advantage over students who go the classical route, because at an age the others barely finished their abi/matura, you have a finished education with practical experience and you can start a bachelor’s degree at the same time. Fachhochschule has the additional advantage over universities that they are more practical and allow part-time studies which allows you to self-finance your studies without needing a loan. So tons of advantages imho.

I’d say the easiest step for a state in the US to take would be to ensure a good orientation course towards the end of highschool. One that aims at informing students of all their options, how much they will pay or earn during training and what they can expect in terms of pay and opportunities later on. Even better if they get a month or more to get a real look at a job. In germany, while the university education was pretty much free you still knew you would lose money while you’re there but you would end up with many job options. In contrast a vocational training was always the safe choice where you earned as you learned. The big risk being you end up hating the job or the people you’re working with and having to restart on a different career. One example, a friend of mine was training to be an optician but the owner of the store he worked at disliked him, made problems and would have forced him to repeat a year or more. As a result he switched carrers and is now training to be a court clerk. Easier than trying to complain about unfair treatment.

I loved Jack’s evaluation of the house! He could teach our little David a lesson in walking – and they’re almost the same age I think (17/11/2020). I must compliment your article again: so we’ll researched and presented. You’ve totally earned your PhD :)! It’s always worth mentioning that going to university in Germany is free I think. We’re in England and if I would make comparative articles (e.g. NHS or school system GB/Germany), people would hunt me down. They’re so protective over ‘their NHS’ which lets people die probably every day with millions of people on so called ‘hospital waiting lists’. Anyways: your website is awesome and so full of great information ℹ️!

Thumbs up! Another great article to which I can again contribute my own and my family’s experience. Last week I had shared that I spent my childhood in Italy and went to the European School in Varese. But I didn’t get to continue the European School philosophy when we moved back to Hamburg just in time to start the Gymnasium in 5th grade. Since everyone was new at the Gymnasium I seemed to have an easier time adjusting to my new school. My two-and-a-half-year younger brother, however, had to switch from the European system to the German system in the middle of Elementary School, between 2nd and 3rd grade. That was a tough transition for him, so much so that once he got to the Gymnasium in 5th grade he failed out after the 6th grade (Beobachtungsstufe) and continued at the Realschule. I, by contrast, was successful in finishing my Abitur (btw, there is no “r” in Abitur) after the 13th grade (yes, back then we had 13 years of school). The Abitur was, at least back then, comparable to the American Associates Degree. My brother, however, finished the Realschule and then continued his education as a car mechanic going to school and working an apprenticeship at Volkswagen. He was very successful at that. After completing his apprenticeship and getting his degree he went on to pursue his Fachabitur, an Abitur focused specifically on his trade. He then got a very good job with STILL (forklifts) where he still works today in management. While I pursued my academic career and moved to the United States, he stayed in Hamburg.

Great topic! As a person close to retiring, I ‘m going to comment on this blog episode by taking a look back over the years to some ofthe people I interacted with and their background. It long ago lead me to reevaluate the mantra that the only path to financial and personal success was a 4 year university degree which is something my well meaning non-college attending parents emphasized to me as I was growing up. Over my life, I’ve accumulated lots of personal anecdotes challenging that assumption. I have a university degree in engineering along with graduate school. I think you make a very persuasive case that the US needs craft and trades workers and associated training in specialized high schools as much as if not more than university graduates with sociology and similar degrees that don’t pay off in the long run. My first job using my newly minted degrees was with a company that I ended up working for 20 years. During that time, one facet of the ongoing training, in addition to attending professional conferences and university classes, at this company was to send interested staff to week long detailed systems training at some of the power plants for which we performed engineering support. I loved every minute of it! It was a totally different learning experience than, for example, sitting in a university lecture hall listening to the professor walking through the solution to a fluid mechanics problem set. Some of those courses had the plant operating staff teaching as well as attending.

Education is the main away out of poverty. I grew up in a kind of low/middle class area in the UK (home ownership and social house renting) and was lucky that the education system in the UK allowed me to go to university (even if a little late in life, around 26) and get out into the world of better paid work. I germany I live in a fairly well off area (although it is mixed, I live in a city so well off/not so well areas can be close to each other), but I still see low paid work and poverty rolling down generations. In my daughter’s class in grundschule there were several kids who were not that academic but could have managed if they had received some support. Their parents worked low paid jobs (with shifts, long days, very early starts) so support from there was lacking (not their fault, but it is what it is) and there were 26 to 28 kids in the class. Some of those kids will find a job that pays better (talent, interest of their etc) but others will end up doing jobs like their parents (much like the better off kids will end up doing jobs like their parents) and the situation rolls on. It’s obvious that not everyone can achieve the same as everyone one else, not everyone can be a David Beckham, a Bill Gates, or an Elon Musk. What we can do though, is give the kids the absolute best start from which to build their lives on, Not all will climb high due to personal factors, but we can give them the start they need to, if they can.

Wow, very good content and very good explained. Only one little thing : it is Abitur, not Arbitur.🌞 And an addition: Also, if a person has no Abitur, the person could study later on, after finishing Berufsschule. And on the other hand, if a person would wish to recieve Abitur later on, as an adult or after learning the job, we have schools to do that beside you work. It’s Abendschule. Like in Berlin: Berlin Kolleg.

unfortunately in Germany there is also (or at least has been) a push towards „uni for everyone”. this leaves many young people with academic challenges that simply frustrate them and then (even if graduation was successful) leads to jobs that really never required a scientific/university education in the first place which further increases frustration. I guess there is also a bias in German families. When both parents went to uni they would kind of hope that for their kids too. But at the same time someone with vocational training would usually not be looked down upon. Something I also know having worked both in the US and Germany: many jobs that require an engineering degree in the US (like programming a CNC tooling machine) is a vocational training job in Germany. so the people getting vocational training get to do much more interesting/ rewarding things/jobs in Germany I would say. And then, one thing I think is really REALLY important, and I say that as a German engineer: when talking about high quality German luxury products (cars, kitchens, washing machines, knifes, …) it’s always labeled as „German engineering”, though it’s really not that much about the engineers. there are good engineers anywhere in the world. it’s about the highly skilled, THINKING and „quality proud” people that put the products together, that actually make them. I noticed this first in vehicle production in the US (fork lifts in my case but I am sure this translates to other manufacturing jobs): the people at the assembly line in the US are absolutely clueless about what they are really doing there (of course I am generalizing, but actually not that much!

My favorite part about the German education vocational system is that some careers (like carpenter) still offer a traditional Wanderschaft. Leaving behind most your worldly possessions, wandering the country for three years and a day, working for room and board, advancing your craft under different masters, not going home nor staying in the same town for longer than six months. That’s a socially accepted way to advance your career.

Quite a few white collar jobs do not require a university education in Germany. Various kinds of clerical jobs are part of the dual vet programs. This is, incidently, the whole point behind the introduction of the Realschule in the late 19th century. Originally, it was the school for the kids of the middle class who needed “useful” skills for “the real world” (hence the name).I.e. modern foreign languages instead of the Gymnasium’s latin and ancient greek, or more practical mathematics curriculums that prepared them for clerical jobs or running a business.

I went to HS in the US, and then started to study…. I then moved to Germany, got my Wirtschaftsabitur, and started to study here. Life happened, I changed my path and did an apprenticeship as an Industriekaufmann. The things I learned in the apprenticeship had much more value for me than things I studied at Uni. Many of the things I did in the apprenticeship I could apply in my personal life as well. The apprenticeship was a huge win for me.

First of all: Thank you so much for your great appreciation of German achievements and systems – it’s truly heartwarming!! Then: The correct term for the final exam at the Gymnasium is ABITUR (no R in it) (latin: abitur = engl.: “ready to leave” or “wants to leave” 😀 ) My story: Back in the 1990s you had to wait for a permission to university if you didn’t have the best Abitur results. So I did what many others did: Start a vocational training that had a connection to my study subject. I could finish in a shortened time of two instead of three years because I had the Abitur. And I had a huge head start when I finally entered university as I had two years of hands on experience in a business of my future profession. In that case it was Architecture and my apprenticeship was Architectural Draftsperson (Bauzeichner Hochbau). On top of that I was an affordable worker for my employer/trainer. Some say it’s exploitation which can be true in some cases. In my case it was a win-win-situation. That was more than 30 years ago and today I have my own architecture firm. Soon I will start to offer apprenticeships for draftspersons. Fun fact: It’s common in craftmanship to execute some sort of initiation on the newbie apprentices. Often they get sent to other companies to run nonsense errands or fetch super heavy or gross objects. Example: You’re supposd to fax a certain amount of empty pages to another office because they ran aut of fax paper. Everybody is previoulsy informed and it’s a great laugh for (almost) everyone in the end.

After achieving my Abitur I did Dual VET as a dentist’s assisstant/dental nurse for 2,5 years (2 days Berufsschule in the 1st year, 1 day in the other 1.5 years) and then went to university to study. For my degree (Lehramt Berufsschule/Oberstufe Fachrichtung Gesundheit) it’s required to have a medical VET certificate because as a teacher in the VET system you have to know not only the theory of the subject but also the practical part to teach it to the apprentices. I liked my Dual VET because it gave me the chance to figure out my future and save money for university at the same time.

An important missing point in the school system is the FOS (FachOberSchule) which students from the Real- oder Hauptschule can go to get their Fachabitur, which is kinda seen as a half Abitur. But it allows you to go to the FHS (FachHochSchule) which is a second form of University where you can study. With an Abitur you can go both ways but most Universities reject the Fachabitur. I myself went Grundschule -> Gymnasium -> Realschule -> Berufsschule (Ausbildung) -> FOS -> FHS -> Master of Science. We’re in the land of possibilities 😉

I guess I’ve kinda surfed along both the college and vocational tracks. I graduated high school in ’84 after taking four years of auto shop. I spent the next two years after graduating doing work in restaurants and odd jobs before commercial fishing in Alaska. Sadly, the high school auto shop closed immediately after I graduated. After I was finished fishing (six years), I used my earnings to invest in the establishment of an auto repair facility that eventually lasted for twenty years. I bowed out after a couple years, and met my wife. She helped support me to go on the complete an undergrad as well as graduate degrees. I worked as a consultant and as a planner, but eventually settled on doing automotive restoration on vintage German vehicles. Full circle. While I really appreciate the German vocational tracks, I do worry that some folks maybe stuck in a track that doesn’t fulfill their passions and intellectual desires. We need to provide kids/adults will all manner of roadmaps to achieving their highest aspirations.

Okay I might say something rather controversial… I switched school gears up, before failing at university. So I ended up needing a job and went to vocational training. I hear often that my tained coworkers complain and mock my bosses for having no clue about anything practical. Yes sure, but they do not have a clue about what they are doing… I experienced this often from the practical side, but that could just be normal I don’t know. As for the education. My hands on trainers, their program and engagement was amazing. The problem was the school. Some teachers were there to just clock off time until retirement. I never hated school until I got there. And I think that is a problem here. Overall being a mixed bag was helpful. At Realschule I learnt with the help of my teachers to organize myself so I could go to Gymnasium and uni. Uni gave my tons of knowlegde and I found my best fit in case of a social crowd, besides life skills from moving away. Vocational training helped with slowing down a bit and due to being older and having more theoretical knowlegde, teaching and guiding people. So I would say the system here is more forgiving for failing or a change of mind.

I left school after the 11th grade, did my conscript service with the Army and afterwards started my vocational training. Since my grades in school where good enough I was able to finish training earlier and stayed with the company ever since…this year will my 25th anniversary there;) My wife did her vocational training after finishing her Abitur, switch through several different jobs and Companies and earns a six-figure salary per year…so,no you do not need a University degree to succeed and live a happy life. The focus on University is quite strong here in Germany in the last couple of years, no one wants to take up a trade job anymore…Good luck finding a craftsmen when you need one